pity the fool

From the comments section:
"Pity the fool who bought this... Buying an asset which doubled in 3 years is nothing short of idocy..."(sic)

5164 Madeira Court
Asking price: $1,090,000
Selling price: $870,000
Previous selling price: $389,750 (2005)
Taxes: $5,240 (2007)
Days on the market: 36
Listing agent: Betsy Carstairs, Park Georgia Realty Ltd.

Even though this 1,972-square-foot house...sold for $220,000 under asking, the selling price was still $480,000 above what (was) paid for it about three years ago.

"Unlike financial markets, real estate is always a good investment," agent Carstairs says. What else is she going to say? The place has shed value in the week passed since it was sold.

...built in 1971, is in need of some (major) updating — brown carpets aren't for everyone — but it has attractive features...it's on a dead-end street... It is fitting that it is on a dead end street, it is a dead end investment.

The new owners are "excited about the idea of giving this '70s-style home a facelift," ...Carstairs says. "They can't wait to roll up their sleeves and work together to create the home of their dreams."

(italics mine)

Now, that is just crazy. They were asking 3 times what they paid for this house three years ago, and got double - without doing anything to the place. The new "owners" will need to put $100K into the place while it is dropping in value. Will it go back to 2005 value? Oh, yeah. Will it go back to 2003? Oh, yeah. How low will she go?

Just imagine paying $500/month in property taxes on top of the mortgage payments, new furnace and windows, new roof, new kitchen, new everything. This place has a great view, but is a bad deal, IMHO. The ones who bought it in 2005 hit the jackpot though...

kit houses - a blast from the past

I read a story at the Glob of Mucous about Sears homes delivered by rail (in pieces) in the early 1900's. Prices ranged from $400 - $3200, and you had to build them yourself (or hire someone to do it). Cute little houses they were too. Sears would give a ten year mortgage on them with payments of $30-$40 per month. During the Depression, people did default on them. Now, houses, and the monthly payments, are 100x more.

Oh, sweet nostalgia.

Edit - I forgot to mention (from the article) -

The price was cheap. The materials were not. Cypress shingles, bronze door hinges, glazed windows, granite bathtubs. They came in styles and shapes and sizes befitting a wealthy farm owner. They also came in smaller sizes, at prices affordable to even an immigrant coal miner.

They carried evocative names such as The Montrose, a seven-room, one-bath Eastern colonial with green shutters, flower boxes and a hooded gable entrance. "Justly considered a beautiful home in any community, no matter how exclusive," said the catalogue.

Granite bath tubs - fergit yer granite counter tops - those are low-brow.

And the marketing was good then too - according to the catalogue. Evocative names. ...no matter how exclusive. No mention of luxury though.

old is new, but getting old again

I posted about this house back on October 30th here.

I first looked at this place V613952 (and walked away in disgust) back in summer '05. It was listed at $349k. I saw it re-listed fall '06 for $449k. Now it is $429k.

It was ludicrously priced last year, as this place is a POS. The blurb claims renovations, but I am dubious about the quality of those. Likely just some paint over mould. Maybe they took the garbage to the dump, and cleaned the leaking toilet.

They may actually sell this place some day for $200k. I'll be following it down as one of the poster children for the crap that people are trying to get rich from.

urban renewal

image from save the cob garden

This is an interesting story that has been going on for quite some time in East Vancouver.

There is a lot at the corner of Napier Dr. and Salsbury Dr. in East Vancouver that had become "overgrown" with large trees, a few of which were rare, and two century-old pre-fab worker's houses (which were listed #6 on the City's Heritage schedule of threatened historical structures). In addition, there was a cob house built by local residents (picture above). For decades, local children played in the gardens, which were cultivated by locals. The owner had no objections to this use. The lot became a de facto park over time.

After the death of the owner, his estate sold the lot in 2005 to a developer, Niebuhr Construction, for a reported $700k. The developer had plans to demolish the gardens, heritage structures and the cob house in order to erect two duplexes on the property. These plans were vociferously challenged by local residents, who eventually lobbied the Parks Board to purchase the property and maintain it as a park and learning centre. The Parks Board agreed, and offered the developer market value. The developer refused to sell it, and hired homeless people to squat on the lot, and to keep children and locals out. They also destroyed any work that the local gardeners did.

Finally, the locals appealed to the Board of Variance, who proceeded to overturn the development permits. The developer took the City to court, and the City Council fired the five member board en masse, and hired a new board friendlier to the developer. The new board reversed the fired board's decision, and the court case was dropped. Then the fired Board of Variance went to court to challenge their termination. For the whole saga, check The Republic stories here and here

Recently Niebuhr Construction sold the property to another developer for $1.2 million. Last week I drove by and saw that the two heritage structures had been torn down, and a lot of the trees removed, and the gardens bull-dozed. The cob house still stood. Tonight I drove by and saw that the cob house is now gone, and there is an excavation pit on the contentious property.

Okay, so it's a free market, and the owner is allowed to do as he pleases, but it's a damned shame. A quite nice neighbourhood has had it's guts torn out in the spirit of growth.

comparable?

This place at 2770 McGill (v612788) is a steal for only $628k.

Last year we looked at a place (comparable, if a bit smaller?) just down the block at 2710 McGill, which was listed for $325k.

I'll let you make your own deductions.

old becomes new

This one is interesting.

Last summer there was a fairly decent house at 5290 Bursill. It was listed at $425K. We felt that it was over-priced, and that the bubble would burst in the fall, so we enquired no further.

This year there is a brand new house at that address (v609708) listed at $698k. It is 1799 sq.ft., (with 5 bedrooms and 3 bathrooms). I have no idea if they paid the list price, or over/under list, so to be fair, I'll guess list. I read not too long ago that 2006 building prices in East Vancouver were about $186/sq.ft., so this house would have cost about $335k to build. Add that to the list price ($425k - 2005), add in PTT and commissions, and these people are losing their shirt on this one.

I'll admit that it is a little bit nebulous, they might have paid $375k for the house last year, and building costs may have been a bit lower. But it does not look to me like anyone is getting rich on this one.

The new brave

This post One Madison Avenue over at Vancouver Condo Info left me a bit unsettled, but elicited a resigned chuckle too.

It is being marketed by Bob Rennie, and is in Burnaby. But wait a minute - isn't Burnaby a suburb? Didn't Bob say "be brave or move to the suburbs"? I guess that is so yesterday. Today the new line is "be brave - move to the suburbs". Down the memory hole.

The blurb claims that this development is "only one minute from Vancouver", and I guess that's true. If traffic is good you can hit Boundary Road in one minute, and from there, only 20 minutes to get downtown.

The listing is 647 sq.ft., and is sitting on a spacious 294901.20 sq.ft. lot. I wonder if it is possible to build a coach house as a mortgage helper. Of course this spacious condo gives you the option to have a mortgage helper right in the unit itself. Shared laundry, bathroom, and bed itself are selling features that make me want to be bold.

Originally listed for $207,900 in May 2004, now listed at $325,900, this splendid property in a prestigous location has a history of being a money-maker. Be brave now, or move to Spuzzum!

old is new...again

This quaint charmer (v6184321) was listed last year for $348k (2005 - v526117). It is still (again?) available for $459k. 31% rise in price? Hmmph!

Will we be looking at this self-same listing next year for $601k?

Is an SFH really going to cost $1 million by 2010?

old is new 2.2

This sweetheart (v6141511) has been around for over a year. I originally did a drive-by in autumn 2005 when it was priced at $385k. One year on it's listed for $509k. That is a 32% increase. That takes balls when the market in general has increased by only ~20%

Maybe they will get $700K by the time the Olympics roll around. It does have six bedrooms, so it's got potential for a quaint little Olympics B'n'B.

old is new 2.1

This place is almost the most famous POS in East Vancouver. It has been alluded to on RET, and VHB.

I don't have the price history for this particular hovel (v5836651 $462k described as "neat and clean"), but the place just across the road was $325k last summer, and I'm sure that it was much more presentable (else I would not have even driven by). Maybe the price was so low because this place is what you would see out your front window?

old is new 2.0

Here's another honey in East Van. It was listed for $369k summer 2005, and is (still?) on the block today for a cool $445k (v6151021). It looks like the same photo' used in the listing last year (my near photographic memory at work), so I wonder if the vendor just keeps putting the price up as the market goes.

A lot of what I will be posting in this vein was never seriously considered at the the time. We just drove by a lot of them. We already felt that the market was nuts, and that a crash was imminent.

unreal.

Update - anonymous has posted that this one sold on Oct. 22nd for $435k after 19 days on the market. I don't know if it ever sold between last summer and then. Are the speculators just flipping these things back and forth? Anyone care to do the math of PTT, commissions, etc. based on a couple of flips?

old is new

I've been meaning to do this for a while. I have a couple of sheets of paper with listings, MLS #'s, addresses and prices from the spring and summer of 2005 when we were looking to buy a home. I thought that it would be interesting to see if the places we looked at were still on the market - whether they are being flipped, or if they have just plain been languishing for 16 months. I have dozens of old listings in e-mails too. The broker stopped e-mailing us when what we were looking for was over $425k - last winter. I have located a few of the listings already, and will be adding them here as the days go by.

This dream home (v6139521) was one that we looked at last summer (2005). It over looks the SkyTrain in between Joyce and 29th Ave. stations, and was nothing short of a tear-down slum when we viewed it. We were actually embarrassed to be looking at it, and felt dirty when we left.

When we looked at it, it was $349K, and listing v519***. We figured at the time that it was "worth" $249k. Now, it has been renovated, and is listed for $449k (Better hurry!). It does not look to be any different outside, but it might be the same photo as the original listing. Maybe I'll waste a half hour and go and look at it to see the "improvements", and report back.